Jesse on Paulette Cooper and CAN
Note: Weinberg is not earning his multiCoSbucks..........He doesn't know the old CAN, CULT AWARENESS NETWORK. Could he possibly think Jesse is talking about the COS CAN?
From Prince, Volume 1, June 18, 2002
86 1 THE COURT: Okay. And what -- who is this 2 woman?
3 MR. DANDAR: Paulette Cooper.
4 THE COURT: And how did you find out about 5 Paulette Cooper, since Mr. Weinberg objected?
6 THE WITNESS: I was briefed about it, and I 7 remember her specifically.
8 MR. WEINBERG: Well, hold on. That's my 9 objection. This is just pure unmitigated hearsay.
10 MR. DANDAR: Not when it comes from a corporate 11 client.
12 MR. WEINBERG: Well, wait a minute. He was 13 only in this position for -- whatever he said -- '85 14 to early '87. And if I understand this, he's now 15 going to recount some supposed incident that 16 happened in the early '70s before he was even part 17 of --
18 THE COURT: Within -- within the organization 19 to which he was the higher echelon person.
20 MR. WEINBERG: Well, RTC didn't even exist back 21 in the early '70s when this supposedly occurred.
22 MR. DANDAR: But Department 20 did.
23 MR. WEINBERG: Could I --
24 MR. DANDAR: I'm sorry.
25 THE COURT: You can, but your objection's going 87 1 to be overruled.
2 MR. WEINBERG: Okay. Well, I'm just making a 3 record.
4 THE COURT: All right.
5 BY MR. DANDAR: 6 Q How did you find out about Paulette Cooper?
7 A In 1977, when the FBI raided Scientology 8 headquarters in Los Angeles, they broke into a department 9 called B1, and they removed a lot of files.
10 Q Scientology department?
11 A A Scientology department. It was their 12 intelligence branch. 13 One of the problems on the files which led certain 14 people to go to jail -- I guess 11 people went to jail over 15 this -- was the fact that every operation, including the 16 operation like the LSD in her toothpaste -- put LSD in her 17 toothpaste to make it seem like she's insane, or to lift her 18 fingerprints off a glass and put it on a bomb threat, which 19 she was eventually being prosecuted over -- I mean, these 20 things were written in detail of exactly how to do it. And 21 it said on the top who it went to, who approved the program, 22 who executed the program. In other words, details which 23 later came back to bite them severely. 24 So in putting this new OSA, this new branch there, 25 that had similar functions, but were supposed to operate a 88 1 little differently. These reports came. Again, it said, 2 "Eyes only." There was no routing as to who it was going 3 to. There was no author. There were just paragraphs which 4 were just summations of different operations that -- that 5 Scientology were enacted to discourage people who were in 6 lawsuits against it or critical of it.
7 Q And then those -- what you saw was then destroyed 8 in some way? 9 A We were -- we had to shred it immediately. Part 10 of the new policy -- and Vicki Aznaran is one of the people 11 that told me this -- everybody had to had a shred. There 12 were only certain designated people these reports were going 13 to. And we had to verify we shredded the reports. 14 But the reports themselves only contained brief 15 statements of the activities, not who were doing the 16 activities or any details like that. 17 Q Would those activities include picketing, critics?
18 A No. These -- these were different. 19 I -- I'll give you an example of an activity.
20 There was an organization called CAN, called Awareness 21 Network, that Scientology had apparently been fighting for 22 years. I had no knowledge of it myself, but I would receive 23 a report that there was a deep cover in CAN, listening in on 24 the legal process CAN was involved in, lawsuits and spats 25 with Scientology. 89 1 This person would get privileged information --
2 MR. WEINBERG: Your Honor, I object --
3 A -- report it to --
4 MR. WEINBERG: I --
5 THE COURT: Excuse me.
6 MR. WEINBERG: I believe that CAN didn't exist 7 in 1985 through 1987. What's Mr. Prince talking 8 about?
9 MR. DANDAR: Well, that's good cross 10 examination question.
11 MR. WEINBERG: Well -- but then I object to 12 whatever it is: Hearsay, competence. And he's up 13 here talking about some organization that, if I'm 14 correct -- and I think I am correct -- didn't even 15 exist when he was there. How can he be talking 16 about an intelligence operation with regard to it as 17 if --
18 THE WITNESS: If you'll let me finish --
19 THE COURT: Well, just a minute. NO, you don't 20 get to talk --
21 THE WITNESS: Oh.
22 THE COURT: -- until I make a ruling. And we 23 surely do not need help from you. At least, I 24 don't, in making my ruling. 25 Now, when did this occur, Mr. Prince? 90 1 THE WITNESS: The specific example that I'm 2 telling you --
3 THE COURT: Yes.
4 THE WITNESS: -- are things that I've read with 5 my own eyes concerning a group -- it was either CAN 6 or something like CAN -- that Scientology wanted to 7 get rid of. 8 So a person was placed in there, deep cover --
9 THE COURT: You are so far ahead of me. Don't 10 incur my ire, because it's the afternoon and it's 11 getting close to 4:00, and that's bad for you and 12 everybody else. 13 When did this operation take place, whatever it 14 is you're talking about? When did it occur?
15 THE WITNESS: It was either 1984, 1985, 1986. 16 It would have been somewhere -- 17 I'm giving an example of something that I read 18 within those three years. 19 THE COURT: Okay. And that's when it occurred?
20 THE WITNESS: Yes.
21 THE COURT: And you were in the organization?
22 THE WITNESS: Yes.
23 THE COURT: And you read it as part of the 24 documents of the organization.
25 THE WITNESS: No. As part of the envelope that 91 1 would come by, like I explained earlier.
2 THE COURT: Oh, and you read it on -- in what 3 was reported to you.
4 THE WITNESS: Yes.
5 THE COURT: Overruled.
6 MR. WEINBERG: I understand. And I'll cross 7 examine him if it has to do with CAN. 8 BY MR. DANDAR: 9 Q So they put an undercover person into this 10 organization?
11 A Correct.
12 Q And what was this person doing?
13 A The person was there as a volunteer to assist the 14 executives of the organization, you know, carry out whatever 15 they were doing. And this organization was an organization 16 similar in some ways to the Leo J. Ryan Foundation, in that 17 anyone from anyplace could call, "I think my kid is in a 18 cult. My daughter's in a cult. Can you give me information 19 about it?" It was an organization similar to that. 20 And this person was put in there to divine and be 21 able to turn over to Scientology's legal team information 22 that would give them an advantage in court.
23 Q Okay. Now, besides the reporting of intelligence 24 and legal operations, did you have anything to do with the 25 hiring of law firms?